Spurs hit franchise-record 17 three-pointers, down Bobcats 109-98
by Ben Swanson on Mar 19, 2011 11:45 PM EDT
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PrintSteve Novak had 19 points.
More after the jump.
I wanted that to be the whole game recap. It says just about all you need to know. Steve Novak went 6-10 FG and 5-8 from deep. The Bobcats couldn't defend the three to save their lives. They forgot that closing out on shooters was an effective method to defend shots and had poor rotation on defense, leaving someone open for San Antonio on nearly every possession.
Basically, the only thing holding back a Tim Duncan-less Spurs team was the Law of Averages.
But, perhaps I'm making this out to be worse than it was. If it wasn't for a horrendous first quarter, this game would have been close.
In the first, the Bobcats were dissected by an efficient Spurs group and also couldn't get anything going on offense. The Spurs attacked a very weak and slow Bobcats interior, mostly utilizing the pick and roll to get the roll man open.
The rest of the game was closely contested but never within reach for the Bobcats.
There were some highlights for the Bobcats, though. Gerald Henderson bounced back from an unimpressive performance last night against the Thunder and had 19 points on 14 field goal attempts against San Antonio. The bench played well, with Shaun Livingston, D.J. White and Tyrus Thomas all in double-figures. Livingston also had 8 assists.
But aside from Henderson, the starters were pretty rough. Augustin was hardly a factor, Dante Cunningham struggled a bit in his first start (Stephen Jackson was out) and Kwame Brown was pretty bad, especially on defense. Boris Diaw was the essence of nonchalance in the first quarter but got involved after that and ended up with 16 points.
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Hard game to watch
I was disappointed that DJ didn’t step up in Jax’s absence and that Dante struggled as a starter. The Spurs played hard the entire game while the Bobcats starter just didn’t show up early on and got behind by too much to catch up. But I’m glad the Bobcats didn’t just give up and they played hard in the 4th quarter and made the game respectable against what might be the best team in the NBA. I’ll be happy with either a lottery pick or a playoff spot as long as this team plays hard every minute until the season’s over.
by Jordan's10YearPlan on Mar 20, 2011 12:33 AM EDT reply actions 2 recs
+1.
I just dont want the team to give up.
"Facts are stubborn, but statistics are more pliable"-Mark Twain
Yes I agree,
I don’t mind my sports teams losing, I really don’t, but only if there is effort on the court and by the team as a whole. Obviously, winning is nicer, haha, but when a team just gives up during a game, or during a certain part of the season, that’s not good.
by Roger, Roger on Mar 20, 2011 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Our second unit responded really well in the 4th qtr
And that should tell us something about the team not giving up. I’m glad that Silas didn’t let DJ and Boris back in the game when the lead was down to 11. And of course, Indiana lost to Memphis. There will still be better nights ahead of us, hopefully.
by mikael matthews on Mar 20, 2011 5:40 AM EDT reply actions
STATS PLEASE
Any stats on our three point defense over the years. My guess is we are one of the worst teams.
by chris in union county on Mar 20, 2011 9:35 AM EDT reply actions
Not quite
We’re 19th in 3 point percentage allowed this year. Certainly nothing to write home about, but it’s decent.
Last year was our best ever for many reasons, especially defense. 2nd lowest 3-point percentage allowed last season.
As for the rest of our seasons, we’ve hovered right around the midway point of the NBA in this category, although we have ranked in the upper half more often than not.
Cats' Magic number: 10
Games remaining: 13
Macdonald Carey: "Like sands through the hourglass, so are the games left to play."
What would stats even do in this situation?
This team is completely different from any in the past 5 years. The roster is changed. The longest coaching stint was Bernie Bickerstaff’s from the first few years.
Any relationship showed by our three-point defense over the years would have no analytical use.
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by Ben Swanson on Mar 20, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Last year we were nearly the best team in the league against 3 pointers
then we met our match with Orlando in the playoffs. This year hasn’t been so good either.
by Ft.Mill Bobcat on Mar 20, 2011 5:37 PM EDT up reply actions
"The Essence of Nonchalance" lol...I like that.
I never thought I’d see Diaw get a tech. Even when he got it, it was less about any animated display and more about the fact that he just wouldn’t shaddup. He really turned up his scoring intensity in the 2nd quarter, but trailed off big time in the 3rd, and basically had a DNP-CD for the 4th quarter. Thank God for D.J. White.
Livingston had the kind of numbers that we need from our starting point guard ( * ahem * ). Cunningham, while not exactly exploding on the scene for his first start, had a respectable 9 points and 5 boards in 22 minutes. Hendo had a much better game than the previous night, but he’s going to have to start being a lot more consistent on offense.
Kwame often displays some of the worst hands with a basketball that I’ve ever seen. I’d be scared to find out how many double-doubles he’s blown this season due to bobbled passes, mishandled rebounds, and awkward shots in close range. Fasten your seatbelt, Mr. Oakley. It’s going to be a bumpy ride.
Thomas is getting there. Slowly, but surely…
I got a big kick out of Steve & Dell’s reactions to McGuire making jump shots. They couldn’t believe it either!
Cats' Magic number: 10
Games remaining: 13
Macdonald Carey: "Like sands through the hourglass, so are the games left to play."
I wanna Make The Playoffs
this sux…i hope Jordan isnt as dependent on the draft for production
Huh?
So, what I’m reading is that let’s use the same logic that got us swept in the first round as a 7 seed?
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
Actually b4 the 2009-10 season (the season we got swept) we drafted Derrick Brown and Hendo right? If Im not mistaken, the year b4 that we drafted Ajinca and Augustine (and wack Singletery i think or was it Dontell Jefferson or were they pick ups and we got Cartier Martin?) idk. Seems like the DRAFT is actually the reason we are always in this mess. But I do remember trading Brandon Wright (other small things) away & getting J.Rich. & its plenty of 2/3yr stars that are well worth the picks in this weak draft. Everybody thas anybody is described as “raw”
Drafting well is a key to success
Drafting poorly and stupidly is partially why we’re in a mess. Trading draft picks and losing roster flexibility is not for the best. Plus, if you trade a pick for a player, it is highly unlikely that that you’re getting a star back. You best be hoping you’re dealing with David Kahn or someone stupid. Also, I don’t even know if I’d call J Rich a star.
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by Ben Swanson on Mar 21, 2011 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
J-Rich
The Bobcats traded more than just the rights to Brandan Wright for him. They were also using available cap space, something that’s still in short supply even after trading Crash.
Trading draft pick(s) for an established player, who presumably will be a lesser player than Wallace, runs completely counter to the strategy of trading Wallace. Assuming Jordan has a long term strategy, that strategy almost certainly involves getting rid of the established players and building through the draft, which not coincidentally saves the team a lot of money.
It’s 20 steps back now and hopefully a lot of steps forward in the distant future. Since Wallace was traded the Bobcats are 3-9. That’s the new normal.
himdsight is 20/20
sure we’ve had some BAD draft choices but in hindsight, were alot of them really that bad? Morrison was a ice cold shooter. Felton/May were “chemistry” picks. (Felt was a top PG). In retrospect I think it was moreso Brown’s system y he didnt flourish. Okafor was a beast (and I bet we wish we still had him: LB strikes again). Augustine/Felton in Silas system A+. Jared Dudley/Wallace or Jackson A+. Derrick Brown with playing time wouldve been just as good as White/McGuire. Samething almost happened with Hendo. J.Rich is not a “STAR” (which is overrated). But he was a 20pt consistent scorer. Ajinca (LB pick) sucked. Is a established 17-20pt scorer NOT worth a pick in a draft full of “he is still raw but, blah blah” draft?
Chemistry picks? When you’re in the second year of the franchise, going for chemistry players in the first round is stupid. If you have those draft picks and your team was is such a position, you have to go for the most talent, not chemistry.
And stars are overrated? What team outside of 2003-04 Pistons have won a ring without a star that they drafted? I remember thinking last year and being hopeful that “Hey, we could be like the 04 Pistons!” but it’s simply not a good way to go about trying to win a championship. It just doesn’t happen.
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by Ben Swanson on Mar 21, 2011 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
go back and look at the 2005 draft
Chris Paul/Williams were taken over Felton. Go back & look and u can count on 1 hand who drafted AFTER Felton is better than Felton (Granger/David Lee) . As for CHEMISTRY I stand by my point. 2yr franchise with not real offensive direction. With Felton/May (i was hoping for McCants myself) at least you had a foundation of a playing style. So it wasnt a bad idea its just that May became content with “just making it”.
tell me if stars mean more than Chemistry
+Lebron, Shaq, Jamison, Hickson, Varejao, Mo Williams = Cavs: Afflalo, Melo, Billups, JR Smith, Harrington, Martin, Nene = Nuggets: Dirk & the whole Mavs roster (any season) other than Cardinal/Mahamani…2004-8 PHX Suns. But you look at the Spurs (they hav their big three but all their numbers are below avg: its the pieces), The Nuggets, & watch the Rockets Sneak in, 76ers, Pacers. JAX puts up just as good if not better numbers THIS SEASON than all their “stars”
How a team builds around a star and talent is up to them
That Nuggets team was incredibly talented until it fell apart this year. I can’t believe you’re questioning their chemistry along with the Mavs and the Suns. That Suns team has meshed for years upon years. And those last teams you named who Jackson is somehow better than their stars? They’re all not going anywhere in the playoffs. the Nuggets have the best shot, but I doubt it.
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by Ben Swanson on Mar 21, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
and we're NOT goin to the Playoffs
Atlanta/NY…Portland ARENT goin to make any noise either. The Nuggets could only beat the Hornets when they did make the playoffs. This Nuggets team I predict make it out of the first round by beating a team better than those past Hornets teams. The Spurs make the WCF. I bet the Pacers put up a fight against the #1 seed the same way the 8th seed Bulls/Hawks used to. The Mav/Suns prove my point about “starpower”. Tyson Chandler in my opinion ALONE moved that team 2 or 3 spots in the west. The Suns again fall short (as always)
in the last ten years how Many different teams out of 30 have won a championship? You could go back about 12yrs and get the same answer. Since 99 (5). If we’re waiting on Paul, Howard, James, Wade, Kobe, Melo, (Boston big 4) ,Williams, Ellis, Durant/Westbrook for a championship then we might as well close up shop and move to Tx, Cali, NY. Its not Happening. You think Igoudala, Granger, Roy, Lemarcus, Kevin Martin, Nash (faces of their franchises) are coming, think again.
But as I always say, there are a GANG of next generation players that just need the minutes to prove they are at least as good as the 2nd tier (B-list). T-Will, Budinger, Cole Aldrich, Mozgov, Wilson Chandler, Gallinari, Beaubois, Harangody, Hibbert, Speights, Batum, Bayless, Shawne Williams, Tony Allen, Kleiza, Thornton, Azibuike, Morrow, Brewer ect…
Exactly. I don't think that any of those guys are coming - You. Have. To. Draft. Them. Period.
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by Ben Swanson on Mar 21, 2011 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions
You can BUT U DONT HAVE TO
its 30 Teams, roughly 15 players per team, 9 of which get to play, 6 dont, and 2 should. That leaves 60 players who should have a opportunity. Plus at least one of the 9 that actually get to play are ready to blossom somewhere in a starting role. So now you got at least 30 more players (established). Thas 90players plus free agency and the draft. I just dont see how the draft can help us. Our goal is NOT just to make the playoffs. Nor should it be for a championship next season but a #6 or 5 spot in the EC. That way you may be able to lure that “star” we all wish and for some reason think we need
Have you been paying attention to the moves the Bobcats have made this season?
The goal is for the franchise to stop losing money. Winning is a secondary and long range hope. The Bobcats will not be a player in free agency this year and will be looking to shed salary commitments in trades. You may hope for more wins next season, but management is looking at the financial picture and the opportunity to draft the future core of the team (hopefully 2012 – 2014).
I understand What You are saying
Azubuike (free agent: cant ask for much bc he didnt play much). Morrow (1.02Mil contract next season). We Arent Goin to get rid of Tyrus (we should but who wants him: sux: and his contract does too) JAX (great player but this maybe his last hoo-rah b4 getting traded to a contender at the END of next season and retiring). Whose gonna take Livingston ?(who for some reason has a 3yr contract). With those guys contracts it may actually be longer than that b4 we shed anything. Diaw also has a huge contract but I think he’s more useful than the other 3 guys for a longer period of time. Now you have McGuire, Pryz, Cunningham, DJ White, Kwame, Eduardo Najera, Matt Carroll. With Kwame being the most valuable piece out of this bunch, I dont see us moving these jobbers either.
We may be big Cats fans but… if it takes longer than 2yrs to get us in a middle spot in the EC, prepare to be rooting for Los Vegas or New Mexico or Vancouver or Pittsburg bc we wont be sticking around CLT for long. We are not a large enuff market to take our time with “raw” players that have more chance of being BUSTS or C+ roleplayers. When there is a plethora of talent at our fingertips WHO JUST NEED A 32min CHANCE TO SHOW U WHAT THEY GOT. (that would actually be cheaper and MORE PRODUCTIVE than a lottery pick)
Bobcats aren't going anywhere
Have you seen their lease agreement with the city of Charlotte? They would have to pay like $200 million to leave, almost their entire value. Charlotte made it impossible for the Cats to leave because we weren’t going to lose an NBA team again. We may continue to suck, but they’ll be here.
My heart pumps no Kool-Aid
by Bring Back Primoz on Mar 21, 2011 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions
you hit it on the head
We are not going anywhere mainly because of that lease, and Jordan wants to make it work here unless Charlotte refuses to support this team for years to come. Then I would take my team else were too. It’s going to be interesting to watch management shape this team to get us to the 6th or 5th seed that should be our goal. 7th or 8th will always get hammered unless they play an injured team.
ezrock
yup
damn near impossible over like a 30 year period. so get ready for YOUR charlotte bobcats for at least three generations before the thought is even considered. even then I doubt it seriously. I like it for the mear fact that cities need time to grow fond of a team regradless of the wins-losses. think about a team like the cleveland browns. they stink on ice year in and year out but have loyal fans, why? its because families in communities need time to make the team a part of their lives. a history must be forged for a team to be successful NOT by the record but rather according to thsoe who live and breath with that team in their home.
"..and we have scott may coming back this season.." bob johnson quote before the start of 07-08 season, when he didnt even know his own players name.
by bobcatsbrendan on Mar 21, 2011 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
didnt know about the lease agreement. The Browns suck now but they USED to be a good team. That is why their fans are loyal. We have never been a good team. I have been a fan since the Hornets (thought they had the same type of deal in place) and they consistently made the playoffs and still got moved. I doubt we’ll still have the fanbase we have now (if u can call it that) if we suck for the next 3/4yrs. We cant call this “rebuilding” bc we have yet to build since we’ve been in the league. With that kinda lease agreement and the type of seasons we’ve been having , i’d like to say that the winner is…..
BOB JOHNSON
Get rid of Tyrus? Whose gonna take Livingston?
Let me start by saying I have rather enjoyed the debate with you and Swanson this afternoon, but I couldn’t help but to throw in my $0.02 here.
Tyrus Thomas has the highest Hollinger PER rating on our team, at 45th best in the league. 2nd highest is Augustin at 95th. Thomas hasn’t even scratched the surface on how good he can be. You do realize that we just resigned him this past offseason, right? Just wait until he cracks the starting lineup. I sincerely hope you’re not saying he sucks based on the games since his return to the rotation, where he was not only rusty, but clearly not 100% healed from his injury.
Livingston is arguably the best free agent pickup we’ve ever had, in terms of potential and value. What’s wrong with a quality back up PG that is capable of putting up starter numbers, at a flat rate of 3.5 mil that expires next season (not counting the team option)?
As for our beloved “jobbers,” McGuire, Przybilla, Cunningham, and Kwame all come off the books this year, so if they’re really as useless as some fans think, then we can all look forward to them being elsewhere next season. Both Najera & Caroll have diminishing contracts, so at least we’ll get some cap relief there. D.J. White is a keeper, plain and simple.
Speaking of White, I sense that you’re rather high on the concept of bringing in some guys that just need a chance, as am I. Well, we did just that with Cunningham and White. Are a handful of near double-doubles in limited action not sufficient to view these guys as diamonds in the rough? I’d actually be a little surprised if Cunningham isn’t resigned. Hell, he’s already my hero for supplanting McGuire in the rotation!
One last counterpoint: Michael Jordan did not sink hundreds of millions into a franchise deep in the red just to move it out of his home state.
Cats' Magic number: 10
Games remaining: 13
Macdonald Carey: "Like sands through the hourglass, so are the games left to play."
Love this One...lol
Michael Jordan thought that he knew what he was doing. He thought he could recognize talent. He thought that he had the right coach for the job. He thought His reputation alone would lure players in. He was wrong. Livingston is not better than Flip Murray (we can argue that one allday)…Garbage buckets/assists and rebs mean nothing. With the exception of Larry Hughes (who probably outplayed the whole team in the playoffs, when it matters) Flip Murray and Walter Hermann (who is also better than Livingston) none of our FA pickups are anything to yell about. I apologize to White/Cunningham in my tirade but I WILL NOT APOLOGIZE to McGuire..
As for Stromile I mean Tyrus, how long do we have to wait for this “upside” to happen. He made the Bulls wait too long now their a #1 team. How long is he gonna make us wait.
Your always hating on Tyrus and Henderson
None of the players you have mentioned before are better then those 2 end of story. Your dream of Hendo being a bench player will not happen.
somehow i believe they will continue to start *sigh*
i am not hatin on these guys at all. I just think Diaw is better than Stromile. I think Walt-Diesel was better. I think Mayo is better than Hendo right now (along with a few others)… I think T-Will could be a good compliment off the bench with Hendo and Livingston. I dont think they suck. I just dont think Swift is ever going to reach that predicted “upside” his career has been based upon
He was reaching it he was better then Diaw
And one of the best players on the team it is not his fault a major injury set him back.
you're right its not his fault
but that doesnt mean stop the presses for Stomile Swift. Darius Miles, I mean Swif, I mean Tyrus got hurt with the Bulls too. Meaning he is injury prone. One thing about Boris is he can get you a near triple double on a consistent basis. He passes well for a big man. Shoots well and Bangs down low (not as hard as he should but who signs Boris to butt heads with the giants?) Im not a big fan of talking about whether or not he WAS better than Diaw (bc he’s never been). He has that eversomuch mentioned “potential” to be tho. I guess he can lead the league in potential for another 4yrs
Ok when does Boris come close to a triple double?
Tyrus has been better since the day he put on that blue jersey, Boris is not even worthy of being called an NBA starter I dont know what you are talking about but you are the only one on this site saying it.
are you serious?
OKC. 13.7.8 Nets 11.16.8 Phila .25.11.11 LAC 18.8.8 on Blake Griffin its a few more but stats can be found on google.
And getting hurt twice in your career is not injury prone
Heck that means half our team is injury prone, so who knows what you definition of that is but its wrong
injury prone is...
hurt twice for damn near the whole season twice in 4 seasons
Greg Oden is injury prone not Tyrus
And im pretty sure you are alone on this debate man Boris really isnt as good as you think right now most everyone would take Tyrus over Boris
Tyrus may be more exciting (when he plays)
Diaw has put in his work. He is just hightly skilled and I think he is one of those players that fits every system. Plus he hardly misses games. (which is just as important). Plus its not like he’s old or anything
Boris has all the talent in the world..
but he doesn’t use it. That guy is VERY inconsistent. Tyrus is very talented, but he’s not mature. Tyrus always causes stupid fouls, and he doesn’t think clearly. Diaw will probably get traded in the offseason though. If Tyrus develops, he could be a Z. Randolph like player.
Tyrus doesn't have a low-post game unlike Randolph or Griffin
That is why we are playing him outside. Its the same thing when he was still with the Bulls. Live or die with his jump shots. Kinda like Hakim Warrick. That’s his ceiling, even with all the potential that he got.
by mikael matthews on Mar 22, 2011 5:05 AM EDT up reply actions
with all the injuries he has no choice but to play outside. I seen some instances where LB had him at SF. it seems we are forcing him into our system sometimes. the way Silas has the boys play, u gotta be tough (Jax Hendo DJ White) or u have to be mobile (Diaw Najera Livingston)..i dont see Tyrus in our mold.
been in charlotte since the hornets days
and there is a pulse, people want to love basketball in this town. not just for the other teams stars to be showcased. we wanted to love bums like kelly tripuka and tamar slay and tim kempton and primoz brezac, and we did when they were brand new to us. yes its true everyone loves a winner and nobodys wants to see losses over a period of too long. but I have seen a fanbase grow from the ghost (charlotte coliseum part 2) to the cable box (TWCA) and its not big yet but give it another 10 years and I bet you we have a strong support for this team in charlotte. jordans plan to make the team lean is the right thing to do. grow thru the draft, add choice free agents who dont break the bank and make a go of it. to hell with the small market lable, winners can happen there>>see san antonio.
"..and we have scott may coming back this season.." bob johnson quote before the start of 07-08 season, when he didnt even know his own players name.
outta curiosity lets say Jordan does draft a Sullinger or Harrison Barnes or one of these “stars” we supposedly build our future with (and let current FA players fall to the wayside yet again) and they turn out to be BUSTS? Is it Jordans fault again? Do we cry for another year that Jordan doesnt kno how to draft just because some avg college player he “overlooked” turns out to be better than a collegiate beast? We’ve tried the “draft” way…lets do this another way.
The Spurs are sucessful bc they take FAs…draft players that we consider “bums” leading up to draft day. They also spend plenty of time overseas and working out those (established end of the bench) guys that we for some reason wanna avoid
What FA's are out there that will get us to championship form?
None, and we will not be able to trade for one so I really dont know what you are arguing.
You Dont Trade for Free Agents
we need not worry yet about “championship” form. We need to get to a place where we are in the 6-5th seed range. It doesnt Have to be just FA. There are players on benches all across the league rotting away bc of some mishap or issue with the coaches (T-Will/Mayo). There are some 6th men out there that are ready for a a starting role. (JR Smith, Thornton (either one), Gary Neal, Harden, Hill, Fernandez ect) There are even some 6th men that may just want a bigger role off the bench (Jo. Crawford, Bayless. Moon, Mo Evans, Kleiza)
WHAT FUTURE ?
It’s painfully obvious that our beloved owner simply cannot afford to be an owner. He couldn’t re-sign starters last year and he had to give up our All Star this year. Everyone says we got picks but that’s all they are is picks and mid round picks at that in a draft that looks very thin to me. If we had the roster back from 2010, we’d be a 5 seed this year. Poor Silas got screwed and he’ll never be able to enjoy coaching a winner here in the QC. It’s very painful, much like what we see on Morehead with the Panthers.
by chris in union county on Mar 21, 2011 10:42 PM EDT reply actions
"If we had the roster back from 2010, we’d be a 5 seed this year."
Damn right. This season was supposed to be the culminating season for the Larry Brown era. Instead, Felton wasn’t resigned (which of course lead to the mess of LB at the start of the season). Jordan knew that it was time to rebuild even before this season started. You can’t just let DJ take over the team and be the point guard for Larry Brown, right?. Its just too bad that the only success that our “best” roster (since the expansion) achieved was getting swept on the 1st round in the playoffs.
by mikael matthews on Mar 22, 2011 4:55 AM EDT up reply actions
I absolutely agree…this is y i feel that the already established players should be our main targets. We dont have the type of market to wait and wait for “rebuilding” thats been taking place since 2004. the lease agreement means nothing when ppl stop coming to the areana
Lease Agreement
The lease agreement effectively means that Jordan would have to sell the team (or lose it in bankruptcy) before he could move it to another city. Relocating the team is not an option even if nobody comes to the games. Just one more reason why he’s focused on reducing his costs and commitments.
further proves my point
if he doesnt make a winning team (at least 45gms: is that too much to aim for) in the next 2yrs he may as well file for bankrupcy or sell the team. the TERMS of the lease agreement DOESNT put butts in seats. WINS DO. the TERMS of the lease DOESNT put money in Jordans pockets. FANS do. How do you get fans? WINS. So you guys can continue to talk 2015-16 rebuilding modes when we’ve been rebuilding since 2004. We now are in a conference where Carmelo, Billups, and Amare are a #7 seed. Lebron, Wade and Bosh ARENT #1 or 2. So what makes you think the Bucks, NJN, Pacers, Detroit & Cavs dont plan on getting ONE piece (probably and est. player) that pushes them over the top us. While we continue to stockpile picks in weak drafts.
Agree Jordan has to win soon
We gained alot of fans goiong through rebuilding will kill all that because the fan base is too unstable right now, it will get better but he needs to atleast keep this team in contention for the playoffs.
agreed..did we just become best friends lol
but i dont think continuing to ignore established talent should be our method. We’ve tried the draft. Not our cup of tea (WE DIDNT MAKE BAD PICKS. THE PLAYERS JUST DIDNT PAN OUT WHEN THEY MADE IT )…except Ajinca. y risk that again?
I still like to rebuild through the draft
But if we could get a really good young player i would trade a pick or 2
I think we are in a major hole. A situation where it seems we dont know the direction of the offense or defense. A situation where it seems we dont have a go to man. A situation where we dont have a bench that can be really effective (i kno how to change that Hendo but noone agrees). With that being said, i think our offseason should be spent on making these decisions. Doing the needed research in trying to find wut pieces complete our puzzle (players). And just hold off on the draft until we at least REALIZE our foundation.
My only point is that the Bobcats aren't going anywhere
I was glad when Robert Johnson sold the team because he was a lousy owner who mismanaged the team. I’ll be glad when Jordan sells the team for the same reason.
The economics of basketball are definitely not as simple as Wins = Profits. The Clippers have been one of the most proffitable teams in the league for many years, while teams regularly in the playoffs lose money. Last year the Bobcats were one of those unproffitable teams.
Can the Clippers count?
They are in LA. the teams that arent as profitable are teams that FINALLY make the playoff in the last 10gms of the season. (when fans have already grown tired of them losing) and teams that make the playoffs and get swept or beat in 5gms
Sit Jack and Tyrus (they are playing hurt)
Because we need to evaluate the young guys on this team. We will finish behind the bucks and if we get lucky Detroit will pass us too. We’ve had so many debates on Boris it’s pathetic, If he was as good as some of you think we would have moved him instead of crash their salaries are 1 mil apart, at least for the same parts. Let Boris be our young guns leader for 13 games he should be able to do that, so we can show case him for his exit out of town.
ezrock
Portland wanted Crash not Diaw
I’m sure if Charlotte could have traded Diaw (or Jax, Najera, Diop, etc.) for expiring contracts, they would have been moved, too. Will be interesting to see what Charlotte does with Diaw and whether there is any market for him.
Boris
His inconsistency which we all know about is what makes him difficult to move. He needs to go to a winning team that does not need him for 38 min per game like we do. At 9 million per year is starters pay in my book. His expiring contract may make him more attractive. The question is what can we get for him? I don’t want a bad contact in return. He just played himself out of ever getting another contract like he has right now. An enigma is an understatement.
ezrock
He needs to go to a team that needs depth
He would be a great player for a good team in the 6th man role
that would be awesome..
i’d like to see him on Boston or LA. Maybe even the Spurs or Dallas
Phoenix
just send him back to Suns for SG Josh Childress and either late 1st rd pick or 2nd rounder or even cash exceptions, Since suns are pretty weak on PF position.
by jjisinthehouse on Mar 22, 2011 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions
i dont think the suns are weak at all at PF
Warrick and Frye can be very dangerous. Mix that with Gortat (who can play the PF) and Lopez . I definately dont think Childress is ANY good. but I do like the idea of whoever we get we should get picks also. Diaw is worth a decent player and draft picks
i dont understand the TANK talk
if we get lucky Detroit will pass us too? Really? Tank for what reason? To Get a higher pick for who? There are no Boguts, Bargnani, Grangers, Cousins, hell there aint even a Joey Graham in the draft (yeah i said it)…we hopin for nothing. We’re fantasizing now as ‘Cats fans. Look at the kind of draft we are TANKING for. Are our standards THAT low now. Harrison Barnes Sullinger, Kemba, Ferdette, the new Graham twins (lol)…Do we really think this franchise’s future rest in the hands of the next few yrs of “raw” draft picks? We are sadly Mistaken.
and Y rest TT? He aint played all season. Make him play. Lets see what he can do. Lets showcase him for other teams bc he’s definately not worth the money he is being paid. people think that i “hate” Thomas. I dont know the guy but this “UPSIDE/POTENTIAL” crap is way overblown. Its easy to score on Orlando when Dwight is on the bench. Maybe we can get a player thats ready to play NOW. bc i can pretty much guarantee Stromile Thomas Miles will for some reason be hurt again at the start of next season
tanking?
That’s not what it’s all about, this team is awful right now. Jack has a bad nagging injury, Tyrus is recovering from a torn miniscus in his left knee, they need to get well. Them playing on these injuries is risky and they are both under performing because of that. We will not pass the Pacers, unless DJ Augustin turns into tiny Archibald of the old Celtics averaging over 25+ pts per game and 15+ assists. It’s not going to happen! Who else can step up on this roster besides Hendo, right now he is not ready to score with high efficiency and play lock down defense. When we drafted Felton, CP3 went one pick before we picked. That’s all it takes, I knew CP3 was very good at wake, but not so much better than Felton who won a title with the Heels. I would not be surprised if Detroit at least caught us. If they do it tells us what kind of roster we have to work with. The truth hurts, we were supposed to have a better season than that in my opinion. I was expecting better, even with Chandler and Felton gone.
ezrock
CP3 is still unproven to me. (i think a healthy Darren Collison is better). Right now it seems to me that everybody want to turn the bobcats into a “i have a new remedy. i hope this works” team. (the Draft is overrated). I feel the same thing about Hendo. He is not ready now and will not be quite ready next season (but i doubt anyone coming out of this draft is goin to help us at the SG position either). We need established players next season. Maybe in the next offseason we can draft. Darn near everyone is coming off the books so its not like we cant go after some solid FA and bought out players.
I agree with FA route
The draft is not going to help that much, only the first three picks may have enough game to start for a losing team in the league. We have enough cap room to get somebody that can have immediate impact, and keep moving our players like a chess board. Too many people want us to go after the likes of CP3 and Steph Curry their teams would want every half way decent player on our team plus our draft picks to make that happen. Who would they play with when they get here? Note to MJ and his crew don’t make the wrong move or it will be check mate, there’s not much room for error.
ezrock
this may be my fav post so far...
im looking around and i see a Marcus Thornton or Mayo
If Montejunas is there we should take him
Even though Kwame is the best he has ever been and should be in the conversation for most improved player, but he should be a back up. Plus im sure Montejunas will take a while to develop so Kwame would still be starting,
:/ i'm not so sure about Montejunas
The guy is very raw…i just don’t know. I would just take the best talent available. Also, sorry but Kwame in the discussion for the most improved player is funny.
maybe he is not the MOST improved
but if u look around the league at the number of REAL CENTERS (not the new breed of shooting big men who couldnt rebound to save their lives) Kwame isnt that bad. Centers are picked to Rebound and Defend the paint. (i think Kwame had done well esp since Silas) and over the last 2yrs he has improved tremendously.
i dont think they would win
but if voting was about the actual IMPROVEMENT (not the team or popularity) then they would both be in the top 15-20
Either him
Or Jan Vessely or Jonas V. I dont think there will be a good SF where we pick unless Jones falls to us, of course Jordan Hamilton has some talent, can Kenneth Faried be a C in the NBA. He would be great with the 2nd pick.
There's really no point to talk about who the team will draft as of now
If they’re smart, they’ll draft the best player available. Simple as that
off the top
Wilson Chandler (FA)…Mayo..Nick Young (FA)…Shannon Brown (FA)…Batum…Blatche…M. Thornton (FA)..Curry (ehhh)..T-Will (prays)..Harden…Matthews..JR Smith…Afflalo (FA)..Morrow (and he’s an expiring contract)..Azibuike…Mo Evans…i kno i missed some potential instant producers and i think most of these contract are mega low…but we better make fast moves or lose out…
listen up....Charlotte isn't going to trade their pick this year.
MAYBE NO’s, but not theirs. Half the players you named are FA’s, there’s no need for a trade. Young,Chandler, Afflalo and maybe Smith all will sign somewhere for a large deal. The only guys who I’d want to trade for are Mayo and Blatche. Mayo could be good with a change of scenery, and Blatche could be our starting center(even though he has attitude problems)
I'm so stuck on Blatche lately...
What do you honestly/realistically think it’ll take to trade for him?
yeah i changed my mind
i read an article on the bleacher report yesterday and i didnt kno he had so many issues… on the bright side this offseason (FA) be stock full of SG’s (B+ talent) and C/PFs…if we dont acquire anything i would be very puzzled
idc abt the draft
as you can see so i dont care whose pick we trade to get any of those young fellas. just try to get one. T-Will, Harden, Curry, Azibuike, Evans, Morrow, Batum arent…and trust me they are ready for the big time. They are also pretty cheap and you could probably get them with a draft pick and one of our expendable players. As for the FAs, we are goin to have to spend a little money to get make a #5/6 team. Since we have really no direction anyway, most of our players are expendable
NEXT YEAR
Anyone think Jack or Diaw will be here next year ? I dream of trades for CP3 ,Chris Kaman or Davis West but I realize it’s all a dream.
by chris in union county on Mar 22, 2011 9:00 PM EDT reply actions
Please no…TO all of them. Kaman is a little over the hill now. Chris Paul isnt THAT good. We dont have the pieces (nor will we be able to if we get him b4 the pieces) that makes him good. (Mobile centers/PF and surrounded by shooters). Hell we dont even have a shooter now. I dont think we get rid of JAX unless we are getting a guaranteed 12-17pt SF. (bc we have NOTHING behind him). I say we keep Diaw too UNLESS we can get a knockdown shooter at the SG pos. Hendo isnt ready for tha bigtime just yet but a bench with Hendo-Livingston-White-Pryz/Kwame-Cunningham would be dynamic
CP3 is that good dude you aRe the only NBA fan that thinks he isnt
Do you just like having the opposite opinions of everyone?
no
i just saw how much better Darren Collison did when Paul was Injured for that stretch of games last year. Look at the pieces he’s had around him. I didnt say he sux but Felton or Brevin Knight (yep i said it) could avg just as many assists with that caliber of players around. Peja, Marco, Ariza, Thornton, West, Okafor, Chandler, Landry…need i go on?
Paul v. Collision
Collison did a great job filling in for CP last year, but he did not replace Paul’s production. Also, with Collison the team disappointed and missed the playoffs. With Paul healthy this year, they are much better and headed back to the playoffs.
Here’s a comparison of Collison’s ‘09-10 season to Paul’s numbers this year. Paul is better than Collison across the board. Using Per 36 Minutes stats, they scored at similar rates, but Paul is better in just about every other measure. Paul also is better looking at PER, WS/48, TS%, RB%, AST%, TOV%, etc.. Paul was and is hands down the much better player.
looking at the per 36mins
are we really goin to debate THOSE numbers? Do you see how close those numbers are? Do you realize that Collison was a rookie? Let me make it clearer. If you take Felton (bobcats version), Lawson (rookie season), Westbrook, Nash and put them in that NOH system I SAY THEY PUT UP BETTER NUMBERS AND STILL MAKE THE PLAYOFFS.
And you would be wrong - even in all caps
Are the numbers really close? Some of them are, but there are big differences, too. The stats essentially show they had similar scoring rates, but Paul was by far the better distributor and defender. Paul has roughly a 50% higher PER and his WS/48 is nearly 4X higher. The difference is between an average (at best) PG and a future HOFer.
a healthy Collison is above avg…and his numbers as a rookie filling in for Paul were great. You forget also come from when Collison was coming off the bench also. If you could find out his STARTING numbers only i bet they would be higher which is incredible…not only that but they didnt exactly miss Paul during that stint…
Chris Paul is the better point guard
I don’t have any stats to compare, I am doing this just by having watched them play.
Chris Paul is poetry in basketball form with some of the passes he can see and make, and he does it consistently. Collison is a good player, but he is not at that consistently high standard that Paul is at.
i agree to choosing Paul over Collison
but if i were to make a top 5 list of PGs, Paul wouldnt make the cut. Maybe #6. he isnt the same Chris Paul that burst on the scene 5yrs ago. since the injury he is still good but (like Kwame Brown) Paul is judged by his past accomplishments rather than his numbers now
Im not good with numbers
But why is is he considered the best PG in the league by every fan and coach and player and analysis, I mean do you think you are noticing something nobody else is and they are just stupid?
Nash, Rondo, D.Will, Rose, Parker are all better in my opinion…Ive heard ONE of the Best. Never heard him mentioned as THE BEST in any season. Paul is a product of a good system. Not saying he isnt good but those guys are better
Iv heard people say he is tied with Williams for the best
How can you put Rondo up there Chris scores better and look at all the people Rondo has around him.
Chris does score more
but Chris could never guard Lebron with success. Chris would never rebound at the level Rondo can. Rondo still doesnt get credit for the way he facilitated that championship run a few years back. He was the reason that Boston played so well. I think who he had around him downgrades how good he played. Look at Chalmers and Bibby, Look at Jason Kidd and Billups (nuggets)…they have always had major pieces and couldnt/didnt do the things that Rondo did for that HISTORIC Boston squad
not really in the last two seasons....
and so is TT but everyone wants to keep him
No need to debate Kaman
The Clippers aren’t trading him for Diaw or Jax. They can do better, and he’s useful as an expiring contract in case the Clippers make a run at trading for a Chris Paul or Deron Williams themselves.
Besides that, Kaman is finally back from injury and playing great. Per 36 minutes since his return, he’s scoring 17.3 PPG on 51% shooting and 81% FT% with 9.6 rebounds and 1.8 blocks. Even counting Kaman’s terrible start to the season, the list of centers this season producing more points, rebounds and blocks per 36 than Kaman is very short – Dwight Howard and Yao (in 5 games).
Kaman has only played 26 games this year...that's not exactly durable
Tyrus has played in well over 70 games his first 3 years in Chicago. He broke his arm last year, but still managed to play in 50+ games. His meniscus tear this year is the only injury that has kept him out for a significant amount of time. Two injuries in a 5 year career isn’t exactly “injury prone”. Everyone also wants him because they believe he still has the potential to be good. The team also resigned the guy, so it doesn’t look like he’s going anywhere soon.
there's that POTENTIAL again
he leads the league in “upside & potential”…sorry i just like impact players. and a meniscus tear is going to take away everything we signed him for. (Rebounding, assists, atleticism)…y risk it
We can't just trade that 5-year contract of Tyrus
But I agree. He shows “potential than numbers” (as quoted from 2k11). But right now, he has a long-term contract with us. So why not risk of playing him all throughout? He is a great role player to Boris Diaw and hell, maybe that’s our winning formula right there.
by mikael matthews on Mar 23, 2011 10:21 AM EDT up reply actions
A meniscus tear isn't a career threatening injury
It also isn’t like an ACL tear that will take many months to recover from. It doesn’t take away your athleticism. It isn’t a small type of injury, but it also isn’t an injury that will keep you crippled, and weaker than before. Look at Bynum. He tore his meniscus a few times, but he still looks better than ever. On another note, why did it take Bynum a few years to finally showcase his talent? Oh yea, he’s developing, and he has POTENTIAL..
Bynum is a special player
comparing Tyrus to Bynum is ridiculous. Tyrus has missed many months if i am not mistaken and b4 that he was recovering from the broken arm (low production). They have been playing the same amt of yrs and Bynum has been a name thrown around as a great center for the Lakers for the last 3 or 4yrs. Which means b4 his injuries he was producing and he never slipped during his returns.
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