ESPN -- Exec: Hornets saying 'No deals for Paul'
We could do a lot worse than Livingston/Augustin. We could do better than Boris Diaw: Starting Center.
about 1 month ago
David A. Arnott
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Calderon
keeps looking better and better (IMO best fit for running our offense) and especially if we could have gotten Robin Lopez in a 3 team deal
:(
GSO
was lopez even a for sure thing? i think that was just a thought thrown out there by some ppl on here…calderon would have been ok but I still think we should just sit tight and ride this out
just cuz they are saying they wont trade paul, doesnt mean they will stick to that mind set
and im sure our back up plans will be ok
Just an FYI
Maybe in my skimming through it I read it wrong, but I thought I picked up that a rival team said that he was told they aren’t moving him. That didn’t come straight from Demps, but from someone saying that. Also, I read it as though the meeting with Paul and the GM, coach, owners, etc, hasn’t even occured yet.
Maybe I read it wrong and I need to slow down and read it again…
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
So...
total speculation…guess that means…
Wait for it…
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions
What I take from it
is that the team has no intentions of trading Paul until February 2011 at the soonest. It doesn’t mean Paul doesn’t want a trade.
imma be EXTRA mad
if Tyson Chandler plays somewhat decent this year…
--(insert quote, lyric, or joke here)
I'm still calling this situation 'hope against hope'
If Paul and the Hornets have their sit down today and Paul is won over and tows the party line then I’ll completely give up on the possibility, but if they finish today and Paul demands a trade then I don’t believe he’ll stay.
Seriously, how many situations have there been where a player demands a trade and then stays with the team any more than a few months? Also, it makes me wonder if they’re committed to Paul and Paul is committed to New Orleans then I think we need to call them back immediately and offer this:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2e5hlvo
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 11:13 AM EDT reply actions
I can't load this at work...who is it for?
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Collison and Okafor for Erick Dampier.
We’d likely throw in a 2nd rounder or something too.
If Paul and the Hornets are friends again, and they still want to move Okafor’s contract then getting Collison would be great. I don’t see them entering the season with both point guards.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I could handle that...and thank you...
Then I would possibly throw Nazr at them also…and maybe re-sign Dampier or Shaq…if Shaq can accept a part roll and a vets min
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions
There are worse things the Bobcats could do than send Nazr’s expiring for James Posey
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions
The Hornets can get a lot more for Collison
Okafor’s contract is bad, but not that bad.
"I could never be a thug, they don't dress this well." - Malice
by Julius Coxswain on Jul 26, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Trading for Collison seems more realistic in that Paul is the superstar
but it seems more and more real that Paul is leaving one way or another and the Hornets know it. Collison may actually be the untouchable pg on that roster, which goes against everything I would have believed a month ago.
Collison is the 'two in the bush' PG
He could end up being better than Chris Paul when it’s all said and done.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 1:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Look what happens when you compare both their rookie seasons per 36...
Paul: 16.1 ppg, 0.430 FG%, 0.282 3P%, 7.8 apg
Collison: 16 ppg, 0.477 FG%, 0.400 3P%, 7.4 apg
Granted, it could be a one off… but if Collison improves in the same way Paul did then Collison looks to be a better shooting version of Chris Paul.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Agree, and why my trade scenario is suggested (below)
Collison is DC4 to CP3! I like his game and would love to have him as our PG for many years.
why would they do this? they are trying to sell Paul that they want to get better not worse.
yes they would save money for now but for what? No more good free agents available out there and they would have to wait until next year to improve. This would piss Paul off and just demand a trade.
It lets them sign more than one max level FA next year
Why would trading Paul’s backup piss him off enough to request a trade, rather than… say allowing them to get Yao Ming and Carmelo Anthony next year
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Personally I would not mind it at all..getting Collison would be huge IMO
but would Paul be willing to play through another year with an even worse team than last year. They would have no C and WHAT IF Paul leaves after 2 years? I just don’t think NO is giving up Collison just like that if Paul just ends up leaving in the end and he probably will now that James and his whole circus of people are basically encouraging him to leave.
It's the status quo that will drive Paul away more than anything
Their current roster didn’t do anything last season, and that’s not likely to change.
New Orleans will not rid themselves of Okafor’s contract without giving something good up… and David West and Darren Collison are their only tradeable assets.
Sure, they’re worse for one season… but if it means New Orleans can become contenders in the future. The 2011 draft is already tracking to be very heavy in PFs, SGs and SFs… so if New Orleans get a high pick, add someone like Melo and add another big time FA then they’re in good shape.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Collison is gold
He’s young, talented and cheap. He ain’t going no where. He’s their insurance in case they trade CP3 or he walks in 2 years. And NO won’t be able to pay a max contract to Melo next year plus CP3 in 2 years…or shall I say they won’t because Shinn is too cheap and he can’t sell to Choest with Okafor on the books so I don’t see how this can be resolved without trading CP3. Collison goes no where.
James I do agree that C is a more pressing need! But who?
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Dude what if ...like... a center is like... only a label? And like... anyone can be a center?
Oh man I just blew my own mind!
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by WhatAboutBob_cats on Jul 26, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Yea that works for coach K
but not in the NBA. Like…
I'm a Center...
5’11" but I know what to do…go ahead and label me…
League minimum please
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
“We could do a lot worse than Livingston/Augustin” just wondering which team has a starting PG situation worse than us? anyone else have a clue?
At a quick glance: Pistons, Cavs, Pacers, Grizzlies, and Heat(!) could all easily have a worse PG situation than ours. Sure, the Cats’ PGs could combine to be league-worst, but that’s far from a given.
by David A. Arnott on Jul 26, 2010 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
livingston/augustin is better than mo williams/delonte… or bynum/stuckey?
I don’t know about that.
I’d say if we go into the season like this, we have the worst PG situation in the league. The pacers, heat and kings (if ‘reke is a 2) are close behind. On that note, I don’t think there’s any way we enter the season with the same issues we have now.
Reke isn't a two, but he does need to take a lot of shots
Take Sacto off that list though.
I like our PGs...
I didn’t say love…I like them…
A healthy Livingston will be great, and I got a positive outlook about DJ…I hope he has that same outlook about himself…
He’s good enough, smart enough, and doggoneit, people like him
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
True. I think PG is Detroit's strongest position
Both of those guys have killed Charlotte on a number of occasions.
"I could never be a thug, they don't dress this well." - Malice
by Julius Coxswain on Jul 26, 2010 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Id take bynum and stuckey anyday and since when is mo williams a bad thing hes the same thing as DJ, a shoot first point guard………… wait the only difference is Mo is actualy a good scorer.
D.J. has the potential to play to Williams' level
Will he? We can’t really say
We're at least in the bottom 5 in terms of pg's right now
If both Livs and D.J. play at maximum potential, that puts us in the middle of the league I’d say, but that’s a big if.
Sorry
But every other deal out there is a waste of time and money. We dont need to get a “little better” we need to get way better. Dragging Baron Davis back from the dead or trading for Calder-freaking-on is hardly gonna help us contend.
how is Mo Williams or Gilbert Arenas or Baron Davis not an upgrade i mean we cant go into the season with DJ or Liv as the starter and those 3 are good PG’s tht can manage a team well
I just dont see the point of going mid grade. Why spend the money and get only marginally better and still not have a snowballs chance in hell of contending. If we cant make the big moves, I would just as soon like to stay with DJ/Livingston and see what they got. Pray for a miracle. No sense in spending the extra money on risky old players like arenas or davis if you still dont stand a chance in your own division.
Go big time, or stay with what we got and develop. No middle of the road crap.
Totally Agree
When only a handful of franchises have won the championship in the last 30 years you have to go for broke once in a while to get on the list. Being a marginal playoff team is better than sucking but it isn’t the goal.
Tend to agree...
We have $13mil to land a nice piece…why waste it on the mediocre?
We took on Carroll to get it…we actually added that pain to the team to sit with Diop.
I’m almost to the point to say…sign Shaq.
Is he past his prime…yes…
Do we have a Center…NO
Someone needs to explain to him that we may tell him he will not start, but with what we got…odds are pretty good he will wind up starting for us…
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
I would love Shaq at the right price
though to play for Charlotte I’m sure he’d want more money than he’s worth.
We don't have $13M to play with, more like $6M
If no other players are traded for less money, we are $7M over the luxury tax TODAY. Therefore, anything done with Damp’s contract depends on other trades we make. We must shave over $7M from payroll and that means Dampier’s contract has to make up that amount (unless we get the full Monte and MJ is willing to pay tax).
why should we take the risk of going into a rebuilding year mine as well get some proven players even if we go to mid level. mid level got us a play off spot last year
I don't think that's what the guys mean...
Maybe I missed what they mean…
I was thinking they meant don’t use Dampier’s contract to land junk
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 12:58 PM EDT up reply actions
“I have been a Hornet my entire career and I hope to represent the city of New Orleans … for many years to come." quote from Chris Paul via ESPN mark Stein. Sounds like the meeting went pretty well in NO. If paul stays in NO i like the Idea of bringing in Baron Davis but our biggest worry would be landing a Center.
NO to Baron
He’s got bad knees, a HUGE contract, and loves the LA scene. He does NOT want to come back to CLT.
I was about to say...
I got blasted 2 weeks ago for suggesting we trade Dampier, Diaw, Nazr for BDiddy & Kaman.
Your probably right, He probably wouldnt want to be back in CLT. Who would you guys pick between Kirk Heinrick and Gilbert Arenas?
Hinrich, for several reasons.
He can play both 1 and 2, a decent assist guy, can shoot and plays decent defense. His contract is MUCH better, and would be a quality vet to pair with Crash, Jax and company.
None of the above
We stay the course.
No more bad contracts, no more signings to regret. We try and move Boris and/or Dampier to bring in a true starting center and give DJ Augustin the chance to run the offense he’s been waiting for.
I liked Kirk Hinrich prior to the signing of Livingston, but we now have a good backup plan at PG. If Augustin fails, and Livingston looks terrible then we cross that bridge when we come to it.
I would much rather everything go to crap this season, cut Dampier, let Augustin and Naz expire and make a run at one of the following PGs scheduled to hit free agency in 2011:
- Tony Parker
- TJ Ford
Also, we’re looking at a situation where Minnesota may be forced to trade either Johnny Flynn or Ricky Rubio following this season, also OKC are on the record as saying they will be exploring options to move players through trade to fill more holes, so I look at guys like Eric Maynor as an option next year too.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree...
I have actually wanted to go this course since last off-season. I really wish we could have gotten Beasley and let T2 walk and have started seriously from scratch but that didn’t happen. We need to take a season and see what we go to move forward with. Many will say we don’t have the time and fans need the team to win now.
Look at it this way.
If DJ is somewhere in between how he played his rookie year vs. last year. He’ll still be a sufficient starting PG this year. We have a good potentially great back-up.
We will get to see more of Hendo at the 2 this year and decide if he shows signs of being our future there or not.
With Najera now on board. I think Derrick Brown gets traded as a fill-in near the All-star break.
We’re set at the 4 with Diaw and TT being interchangable based on matchups.
We’ve never had a true 5 in their prime, so why start now?
Let’s hold serve see what we have and use next off-season to make the big moves, unless something comes along that makes us better but doesn’t cripple us again in the future.
I think Najera gets traded at about the all star break before Derrick Brown does
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
Out of the 2 Najera is going to be more attractive to other teams than D Brown. He plays hard, agressive, and does the dirty work and is a veteran. Teams may think he can get them over the hump to so speak. No-one is going to say that about D Brown this year.
+ I have got to think that we keep him for a couple of years and see what he turns into before we trade him. He is a quality kid, low salary. No need to get rid of him.
Just cannot agree James..
DJ is NOT a starting PG in this league, and never will be. The coaches and FO do not want him playing more than reserve minutes, and the Livingston signing was made (frankly) in anticipation of trading for a starting 1. I wouldn’t call Hinrich’s deal horrible…perhaps a bit high but look at what Felton is making. I agree that finding a starting center is becoming very difficult. I believe we will be forced to cut Damp and sign a FA (either re-sign Dampier or look at potentially Kwame Brown). I know, everybody laugh about KB, but he may be the best remaining FA option. But we must get a starting PG in trade.
If this complete lack of faith in Augustin were true then wouldn't we have re-upped Felton?
Felton’s contract is quite manageable per Storytellers (http://www.storytellerscontracts.com/)
$7.7 million, $8.3 million, team option
Kirk Hinrich’s deal is $9 million, then $8 million and no option.
I don’t know where this talk of ‘DJ never being a starting PG’ comes from, because I recall that a very large portion of the fanbase were practically screaming for Felton to be benched for him during his rookie year. I think the jury is still out on Augustin, he’s just entering his 3rd season. I bet people thought there was ‘No way Chauncey Billups could be a starting PG’ when it took him 5 years to grow in the league.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions
You are very VERY
VERY
Correct
We (I included) wanted DJ to start over Felton.
I agree that the jury is still out on DJ and I think this may be the deciding year for him…
Does he have the stones to lead a team…or will he be bench fodder for the rest of his career?
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions
My thoughts on DJ
If you can go back to the archive and check my very first posts, among them was a prediction that one day Augustin would be either the Bobcats’ 6th Man or win the starting spot. I had very high hopes for him based on the way he closed out the previous season.
Last season he disappointed on so many levels that I felt he was worthy trade bait. I don’t have to wonder about his potential because I’ve seen it first hand. It is very possible (and my fervent hope) that it was merely a sophomore slump brought on in part by pressure from Coach Brown. I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt to a point. But if he’s still with Charlotte when the season begins and doesn’t show that he’s taken great steps toward being the player he’s shown us flashes of I believe it will be time to ship him off while we still can.
My sources can beat up your sources
by Ourdaywillcome on Jul 27, 2010 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you give him the keys and see what happens
We put a high pick into him and let Felton walk. No one denies he has talent, and that his second season was noway near as good as his first one.
He is still young and still working out what it takes methings. As he matures I think you will see improvement. Is it going to be enough → who knows but now is the time to find out if he is a long term solution, part time solution or trade bait.
Bad poker player?
I agree with your statement but I’m guessing MJ has been a bad poker player the last few weeks. Because let’s face it, we were better off before the Dallas trade than we are now. At least Chandler was expiring and could start at C (when healthy of course). Now we have 5 years of Najera/Carroll to deal with and we’re nearly 10 million into luxury tax land.
I don’t think it’s the worst thing in the world to stay the course and punt. Cut Dampier to get under the luxury tax and try to deal Diaw for a C, or sign one on the cheap.
The frustrating thing is small market teams who stretch themselves financially to win 40-some games don’t pan out well. Realistically, Nazr is the only contract coming off the books next year so this problem won’t solve itself over night. Maybe the Dallas trade was worth the gamble for MJ but now we have an extra 7 million riding the pine in 2011-2012 that could be used a lot better elsewhere.
Still hoping we have something else up our sleeve.
Fans never fall asleep at our games, because they're afraid they might get hit by a pass
by Bring Back Primoz on Jul 26, 2010 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions
i agree
although we are worse than before, we arent bottom-feeders…. yet.
sure, a healthy Chandler, as we witnessed in the USA game, can do some damage. and yes, we do now have a Carroll/Najera monster that has to be dealt with.
but Damp can still play somewhat decently. maybe as much as Tyson contributed last season.
as for our PG situation, it can obviously be better, but i dont think that what we have is terrible. Livingston/Augustine will just get the job done—so be it that they BARELY get it done, but they will do decently nonetheless.
at least we arent Atlanta, we could be paying Vince Carter, and we could have Kahan as a GM.
stay hopeful people
--(insert quote, lyric, or joke here)
by StudMuffin15 on Jul 26, 2010 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Arenas
Magee
for
Diop
Henderson
Diaw
We get a Young Center and A Star PG and we get rid of Diops Contract how about it?
I'm still wondering why people treat McGee like he's some throw away center
The Wiz are going to hold on to that dude.
If Paul is staying but NO wants to remake team today...
Here’s a way we can help them do that via a couple of trades:
1: Diaw, Nazr and DJ for Okafor, Posey and Collison. This deal sheds Mek’s long contract, provides a servicable 5 on an expiring deal, a guy (Diaw) who can be a better 6th man Posey (and protection if West bolts next season), along with local product DJ as their back-up. we get a hefty contract back in Mek, but a reliable 12 and 10 center, plus our starting PG for now and the future, and we live with Posey. My preference would be to stop there, but I doubt they do deal 1 without…..
2. Dampier for Stojakovic – I know , that hurts a lot! And doing this would require MJ going into luxury tax land, so I doubt it happens. But we’d be shed of his salary after this season. This gives the Hornets immediate salary space and provides the potential elements to deal TODAY for Melo to come to New Orleans.
Not my favorite deal by any means, but just thinking of what might be done with the Hornets to get us what we want and give them the starting place for making CP3 happy.
I like the trade, but I think there could be a better way to do it.
New Orleans wont want Diaw because of his contract… at least Peja is expiring, with Boris they’re on the hook for $9 million for both Diaw and David West.
So, this is how I would do it:
Trade 1: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=29kt6vy
Trade 2: http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2ah4dbp
Charlotte gets the pieces it needs, New Orleans gets better immediately immediately…. it’s very, very rough on Denver, but they know the writing is on the wall and saw what happened with Cleveland. They could do a lot worse than getting David West and having Al Harrington play the 3.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I like that very much James...
Frankly I want nothing to do with Peja. This deal rids them of Okafor, returns salary flexibility and gets Melo (would probably require a pick or two from the Hornets). I doubt Melop wants to play in New Orleans so I’m not sure he’s willing to go to the mat to push his way out of Denver.
I think I hate
every one of the Plan B’s.
If we arent gonna make the BIG move and become instant contenders, then I would rather keep our home grown talent (DJ, Hendo, Brown, Wallace) and see what we got. It just makes zero sense to trade away those guys to get marginally better. Might as well take the money savings and see what we can do via free agency and draft. Taking on Gilbert or Bdiddy is like taking a huge step sideways. You pay more for a better PG situation and you still have no chance at winning. No deal. CP3/Melo or Bust.
CP# Twitter
On Monday 26th July 2010, @Oneandonlycp3 said:
"The meeting went well. It was great to get an opportunity to sit down with Coach Williams, President Weber and our new General Manager Dell Demps. I expressed my desire to win and I like what they said about the direction that they want to take the team. I have been a Hornet my entire career and I hope to represent the city of New Orleans and state of Louisiana for many years to come."
"We have a great bunch of outside shooters. Unfortunately, all our games are played indoors." - Weldon Drew
I'll tell ya about the Magic It'll free your soul but it's like trying to tell a stranger 'bout rock n roll
"I thank my teammates for letting their men blow by them." - Alonzo Mourning after winning the DPOY award
im going to barf
sounds to me like any last bit of hope can be thrown out the window
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Basketball fan vs Bobcats fan
As a Bobcats fan, I want CP3. Who wouldn’t?
As a basketball fan, I hope he stays in NO. After the insanity that is the Miami Heat, I’d like to see some loyalty even if it’s at my team’s expense. From everything I’ve read, it sounds like LeBron James is trying to Godfather the NBA the way he sees it. He’s trying to influence certain people to go certain places (rumor was that he wanted CP3 to stay in the western conference to form an east vs west rivalry). I’m so sick of him and World Wide Wes and all these agents running the league like it’s their own personal edition of The Sims. I hope CP3 stays, Carmelo re-signs with the Nuggets, and Durantula becomes the dominant force in the NBA.
i agree with the durantula comment
but i still want cp3 and melo :)
Semantics
Read that last sentence carefully…“I hope to represent the city of NO and the state of Louisiana for many years to come.” He doesn’t say playing ball. He does a lot for the communities down there and may continue to do so – but just not playing ball. I know I may be reaching here but I’m just not buying this load of bull. He and his agent know that these words are very important coming out of the meeting and structured it carefully. The genie is out of the bottle.
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 3:31 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you might be reaching a bit
The only possible semantics I could see is if New Orleans told him today
“Look, we’re going to move you in December to New York for Wilson Chandler, Raymond Felton and draft picks… but until then you need to be a good citizen”
Short of that I think Paul really is interested in staying in NO provided they do surround him with talent.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions
That could be
but it doesn’t add up with previous statements of him wanting to be on a new team before the start of the season plus NY can’t compete with what we can offer, namely $13 in cash. I think both sides are going to chill for about a week or so and then a “blockbuster deal” will be announced, hopefully the one you and Ourday were mentioning weeks ago. Otherwise, Paul staying in NO makes zero sense – for both sides!
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions
New York can put together a much better package in 6 months than we can
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=26aasbf
Add Felton in and it works, but the trade machine wont allow it.
This gives $14.5 million in expiring contracts (Turiaf and Curry) they get excellent prospects in Gallinari, Azibuke and Chandler while getting Felton to run the point.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure I agree with that assessment
The meat of the trade is the youth. I like Gallinari (although he’s soft) and Chandler to a degree but Azibuke is average and Felton, while a gutsy, hearty player, would be an expensive back up for two years. I think talent wise DJ and Hendo have more upside and would fit in better. UPS might have to go too although I hope not.
The crux is the sale of the team and Shinn’s health. I really get the sense that Shinn wants out now and not next summer and I think Choest will seal the deal once Okafor is off the books, and yes even if it does mean losing Paul. Every team goes through a rebuilding time and once the team starts winning again, the value of the team will go up.
With Shinns health issues and the team in flux, all signs point to this being resolved sooner than later and the Bobcats have the best offer to land Paul this summer.
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Aziubuke is average? He averaged 14 pts and 4.6 boards in 25.7 minutes last year… that’s a little better than ‘average’.
Chandler is another 15 and 5 guy.
We know what Felton is…
If the Knicks called us right now and said ‘How bout Azibuke, Chandler and Gallinari for Henderson and Augustin’ we would be foolish not to make he trade. I love upside as much as the next person, but the Knicks have players with upside who have also shown they can put it together on the court.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Aziubuke
is a ball hawk who averages 1 assist a game and who has padded numbers due to Nellie ball. I like Chandler’s game but again his numbers are padded on a high tempo team with little to no offensive options. Plus he really should have more rebounds and he plays SF which are a dime a dozen at his level. But again, I do like his game and think he has value. Gallinari is the best of the three but as I said earlier I feel he’s soft, no D and not a great rebounder.
I guess I’m just a homer for Hendo and DJ. Hendo I really believe will be a great player in this league as his jump shot improves. Superior IQ, work ethic and athleticism. DJ is one of my favorite young players and I think he’s gotten a bad rap from LBrown. He lot confidence last year mainly because he wasn’t shown any. Plus, he plays a VERY KEY position at PG.
Those three players from NY all have value and I can see why you would like the trade. I am probably in the minority here but I just feel that Hendo’s ceiling is HUGE and DJ can be a 20/10/5 player in the right system-which LB’s is not (for him that is) at arguably the most critical position on the court. I would hate to lose these two players but if it meant getting a future hall of famer in Paul, I’d do it.
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you’re right, you may be seeing Augustin and Henderson through rose colored glasses.
Right now, I think Augustin has potential… but the numbers you’re saying for him are Chris Paul statistics. Larry Brown is known to squeeze every last bit of talent out of his PG’s, so if he can’t learn from Larry, I don’t know who he can flourish under.
Henderson is still a work in progress. I think he can be a very good, very solid player but it’s far too early for me to see greatness. He has moments, he has flashes… but he’s still insanely inconsistent even in Summer league.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions
DJ is a shoot first PG
and LB doesn’t prefer that style of play from his point. That’s why those two don’t mesh and why he was such a curious draft pick to begin with (Brook Lopez -come on!). In a suitable system, NY for example, he’d could get real close to those numbers. His rookie numbers were 12/4/2 on 25 minutes a game in LBs system. He’s a talented scorer and decent passer he just needs more PT. I feel like last year was more of an apparition than his rookie year plus PGs are so much more valuable than SGs and SFs. DJ ultimately needs a change of venue to maximize his talents unless LBrown is gone next year then who knows.
And don’t get me wrong, I’m not ready to enshrine Hendo into the HOF anytime soon, but I think he could be a Battier type player with more altheticism who can anchor the position for 10 years. His defense is already a huge asset. And believe it or not I’m a Heels fan! Sorry Tyler, but I love my Cats!
In any case, if the Paul thing doesn’t happen, I say keep DJ, Hendo, UPS and use Diaw and Mohammad as your trade bait for a center. OOOOh, how about Diaw and Mohammad for Dalembert and Whiteside. I think it works with $ and big Sam will be off the books after next year. Whiteside is a steal in the 2nd round. He reminds me of a young Camby.
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not as if nobody had ever seen Deej play before the NBA
At Texas he was known as a shoot first PG, and still LB chose him over Lopez… so that should tell you something about how much Larry Brown likes him.
Those rookie number are extremely impressive. They equate to 17, 5.75 and 2.88
Chris Paul was 16, 7 and 3.5 as a rookie and Augustin shot better from the field and from 3P
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Check this out
Looks like I’m not the only one reading between the lines.
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions
BS - I ain't buying it!
I’m sorry but this ain’t over. This is a PR game to keep the fanbase from turning into an angry mob. The fact remains that no matter what they told Paul today, New Orleans is a team that is screwed for years…certainly the next two. Chris Paul is smart enought to know that a young rookie coach and GM are’t going to be beating the Lakers anytime soon so this is just a bunch of hogwash because the bottom line is there is NO WAY they can compete this year and very little they can do next year to keep Paul from leaving the following year. If they don’t trade him now, they get nothing. If they wait until late this year or next, his stock will go down because the team will be nervous of him walking after his contract. If they keep him, who is he going to pass it to? David West-oh no I’m scared. Pedrag on the bench? This makes no sense.
New Orleans HAS TO TRADE PAUL in order to get Okafor off the books and become competitive. They told him that after this year they’ll go after Melo but please, we all know Shinn ain’t gonna pay $120 mil for anything-especially if he has to turn around and pay Paul the following year. This is a classic case of needing to test the media waters for the best senerio to trade him and still keep the fanbase from going nuts. If they don’t trade him for whatever reasons, they will be even worse off in two years than before.
If I’m MJ, I don’t let up. Keep the offer on the table and keep reaching out to those bozos. Something’s got to give soon. Chris Paul will be wearing a different uniform next year mark my words! I only hope its a Bobcat uni and not a Micky Mouse one!
I agree with you
but new orleans fan base isnt gonna turn into an angry mob. They could care less. The Saints just won a Super Bowl, and if CP3 is gone, they will go back to ignoring basketball.
Then why the CP3 tweet?
NO looks better if CP3 forces his way out. If CP3 is OK with coming back then NO becomes the bad guy.
It's a press release in Twitter form.
It either conveys his true feelings (possible but unlikely) or he’s making nice right now in the hope that the Hornets will try to make the trade to one of his “preferred” destinations and doesn’t want to rock the boat. I think (my OPINION, not my SOURCES!) that the Hornets will be quietly shopping Paul to the 2 or 3 clubs most likely to accept Okafor’s contract. It’s their only way out of the corner they’ve painted themselves into. They’ll move Okafor at all costs and if they can keep Paul in the process (VERY unlikely) they will but they know full well they are unlikely to unload Emeka without coughing up either Paul or some other combination of players. ANY move the Hornets make to shop Okafor is going to weaken the team’s fortunes for the next 2-3 seasons.
The rock – Keep Okafor and be utterly unable to make the team stronger without spending so far into the luxury tax that they become completely unpalatable to any potential buyer.
The hard place – Trade Okafor and cough up the central core (or a good part of it) of the team along with him. In doing this they piss off CP3 unless they trade him and immediately go into rebuilding mode in the midst of shaky and antagonistic CBA negotiations. The upside is they make themselves look more attractive to potential buyers.
They have to do one or the other and it doesn’t matter a whit what Paul was told by the new GM in today’s meeting. The proof is in the pudding and Shinn has no choice but to tip his hand one way or another in the next 30 days or so.
That’s how I see it anyway. I have no idea of what this means regarding CP3 coming to Charlotte but I’m not buying anything showing up in the media so soon after the big meeting. The real truth will trickle out in the coming days regardless of what is tweeted, released, leaked, or sworn to in the immediate aftermath of the discussion.
My sources can beat up your sources
by Ourdaywillcome on Jul 26, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Amen
I agree completely. What else can NO do? And what could they have possibly told CP3 that would appease him? I still feel he’ll be in Charlotte regardless of what ESPN or his Tweets have to say. The magic 8 ball told me that, “ALL SIGNS POINT TO YES!”
by blueridgecat on Jul 26, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Makes sense
So the meeting went as follows:
NO: NY can’t put together an offer worth it for us now so play nice so we can get you where you want to go.
CP3: tweet tweet
I think....
CP3 is playing nice for the time being and “wants” to stay in N.O. for damage control to his image and reputation from the media bashing….and I think he may “want” to stay in N.O. if they can win.
All signs indicate that they’re not going to be a contender this season and as soon as the team starts 5-15…he’s going to be expressing his frustration and demanding a trade again.
He may not be on the move prior to the season (hoping he still is though), but he won’t make it past the trade deadline. The team is going to struggle and he is going to extremely unhappy.
Only problem is that we won’t be in a position to get him.
If CP3 had asked for a trade in his twitter, it would be a guaranteed fine courtesy of David Stern
players cannot ask for trades publicly
Lemonade was a popular drink and it still is,
I get more props and stunts than Bruce Willis
- Guru, of Gangstarr
by WhatAboutBob_cats on Jul 26, 2010 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
this is too perfect
--(insert quote, lyric, or joke here)
by StudMuffin15 on Jul 26, 2010 10:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Not sure
But Chris Paul has taken a beating in the press the last few days. Perhaps he’s trying to repair his image a little, let things settle down a bit, and then revisit the trade in a few weeks. MJ-keep pressing because this isn’t over by a long shot.
WARNING:
causes optimism.
i honestly dont know what to take from this. i do believe that CP3 will be traded before the start of the season, but after reading this, i thought about a couple of things:
1) didnt Orlando just deny their desire to get CP?
2) does that Charlotte/New Orleans/New Jersey trade that was mention imply that Melo was on the way?
3) in the revamped East, does adding CP3 to the Bobcats make them equal to the Hornets of 3 years ago?
4) why wasnt Charlotte’s willingness to take on Okafor’s contract mentioned?
--(insert quote, lyric, or joke here)
by StudMuffin15 on Jul 26, 2010 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions
1) Yes they did
2) That’s what I was told. If Jersey were guaranteed Melo and Paul they would send players to us.
3) It makes them better than the Hornets of 3 years ago
4) Charlotte was only mentioned off handed because of market size.
If CBS are accurate then this afternoon’s shenanigans could be little more than a shakedown by the Hornets. I believe Paul still has a measure of loyalty to the city of New Orleans so perhaps this afternoon’s conversation was basically:
“Look, you play ball and act like everything is fine and we’ll move you. If you act disgruntled and demand a trade then we’ll keep you”
If the NBA thinks Paul and the Hornets are happy bedfellows then they can demand more in a trade acting like ‘well, we don’t want to but this offer is too good to pass up’
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Jul 26, 2010 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions
i think i agree 100%
the NBA is a shady organization. so i do think thats the mindset in NO right now. if you look at CP’s tweets, they are all the pretty standard “glad to be here. lets play basketball” lawyer-written standard.
i was thinking about that “Hornets of 3 years ago” comment i made, and i think i can start to see just how we’d be better. we’d have more athletes and more options that arent named Chris Paul, yet, i still dont think that the Paul/Okafor relationship is the best thing for an offense.
ive said it before, and i’ll say it again, Paul needs an athlete to run with him. i know that we’ve said that Tyrus can take that role, but have we really seen that from Tyrus? i think he can pick it up quick and with his mid-range shot, maybe we could get a few pick-and-pops out of him too.
anyway, i think Damps contract goes official by like, the second week of September. if it doesnt happen by then, then i dont think it happens.
fingers crossed, CP Bobcats jersey ready.
--(insert quote, lyric, or joke here)
by StudMuffin15 on Jul 27, 2010 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
CP3 would have an athletic to run with him besides Tyrus
Crash
Derrick Brown
Hendo if he’s still here…
Just decide on what you’re wanting to do to the other team…and what the matchups need to be…
by andrewlail76 on Jul 27, 2010 12:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow...
Kinda shocking to see it just thrown out there…on CBS Sports…
by andrewlail76 on Jul 26, 2010 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Makes sense
Don’t know if it’s true ………. but it makes sense
Fans never fall asleep at our games, because they're afraid they might get hit by a pass
by Bring Back Primoz on Jul 26, 2010 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions
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