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Thoughts on Derrick Brown from a Xavier alum

 

Hey guys, my name is Zak Woods and I blog for SBN at watchkalibrun.com

I am an alum of Xavier University and have watched D-Brown for three years. So I figured I would help inform the Bobcat fans, and Michael Jordan, about Brown (you all know Jordan was playing golf during the 2nd round). 

There is no doubt that Derrick Brown has the athletic tools to play in the NBA. Besides being left handed and 6'8" 227lbs. with the added bonuses of being able to leap small buildings in a single bound. He can rebound, block, play high energy defense --instilled by Sean Miller and hopefully honed by Larry Brown-- and can make any alley-oop that his PG dishes to him. There is potential that he could be the small forward equivalent of Tyson Chandler (not injured of course).  Brown will also be able to match-up defensively against  those monkey wrench type players, think Rashard Lewis

Brown is also smart and has demonstrated some serious leadership qualities. Bobcat fans should feel proud that Brown is leaving Xavier with a degree and developed into a leader on a team that went to the Elite Eight in 2008 and the Sweet Sixteen in 2009.  Derrick has also shown great propensity to listen and learn from his coaches. With the Bobcats being coached by Larry Brown there is great potential for Brown to have an upwards trajectory. 

Now time for some negatives. 

Brown has developed a much better outside game in the past two years but that doesn't mean he can hit the eighteen foot jump shot like another NBA Xavier alum, Daivd West. An optimist would say that this means he will continue developing a solid peremiter game. A pessimist will think that he will be unable to make an offensive impact and will quickly run out of time to develop a NBA-caliber jumper. In this debate Brown's status as a red shirt junior is both a blessing and a curse. A blessing in that he is battle-tested and has shown the introspective qualities to know that he needs to improve his skill sets. A curse, since he will only have limited time to develop necessary skills to remain in the NBA.

Dribbling and passing are also not exactly his fortays too. 

Don't even think about posting up Brown. He needs to be a runner, perhaps swing player, who can hit that open shot 3-5 times a game. 

The final draw back is that Derrick Brown might not have the killer instinct required to play in the NBA (this is an elusive quality but an absolute prerequisite for a player who will not be the most skilled). Xavier has been notorious in recent years for having great offensive balance, which is a wonderful asset in the college game, but not a great thing for developing future NBA players. For Brown's size and athleticism he needed to be able to take over games in the last five minutes, something that he rarely did. Part of this was the offense Xavier ran. The other part was Brown's inability to create his own shot, another drawback. 

While there are flaws in Brown's game each year he worked on those flaws and became a more well rounded player. Xavier fans for some time have known that he was the only player on our team that had the potential to play in the NBA as a high energy 4, for when a team wants to go small and run, or as a big three. The big drawback for Brown playing the three is that he will need to have a solid perimeter game, which doesn't quite exist yet. 

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Questions:

You suggest he can block shots and rebound, yet he did neither at even an average rate for an NBA prospect at his position (PF) in college. What makes you say that?

If, as you can say, he could handle hybrid forwards like Lewis, what does he do if they back him down at only 230?

You kind of acknowledge the same things that have me worried: he doesn’t really have the bulk, game, or skillset to be a PF (which is where we would really need him), but he doesn’t consistently show the kind of stuff he needs at the 3 either. Regardless, I certainly hope he does do well, and I appreciate your contribution to our site.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jun 27, 2009 12:33 AM EDT reply actions  

First of all, most 2nd NBA draft picks don’t work out.

To your point about rebound and block shots, yeah those numbers aren’t what you’d like to see from a college player but Brown was never going to be a 15 boards and 2 blocks per/game kind of guy. My point was that he can rebound and he can block shots.

To your point about Lewis, the Magic 3 doesn’t have a low post game but I get your point. Brown did well playing defense in the low post. Where he really shines though is with his long limbs and his ability to defend hybrid players outside. My point about Derrick’s low post play was that it is offensively non-exisetent.

When it comes to D-Brown’s potential he is never going to be a 20 and 10 guy or a 15-10 guy. But he could be a solid contibutor at the 10-5 range playing 15-20min. Basically he could provide quality minutes and be a quality role player. Which is really a great thing to get in the 2nd round.

Think of him as a possible high energy guy coming off the bench.

watchkalibrun.com

by Zak Woods on Jun 27, 2009 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

Shouldve got Budinger....

instead of him!!! Bobcats should get Bass or Anderson!!!!

by B-cat fan on Jun 27, 2009 4:49 AM EDT reply actions  

Thanks for the insight

Brown sounds like he has the tools to develop into a useful role player. He was a solid choice at the point the Bobcats picked him, and I’m actually encouraged that he wasn’t a big scorer at Xavier since that’s not going to be his role in the NBA either. He’ll have to turn that athleticism into rebounding and defense to be useful, but that seems realistic. I’m far more optimistic about his chances to stick than I was about past 2nd round projects like Hollins or Jermareo. Still, after DaJuan Blair dropped to the 2nd round, I really wish the Cats would have traded up to grab him.

by ClipCat on Jun 27, 2009 10:50 AM EDT reply actions  

Agreed.

The thing about Blair is you get group think. OMG he doesn’t have ACL’s so he won’t last long!

Well he was the best rebounder in college and you can probably get him to contribute for 4 years before his knees fall off. BTW those 4 years will be cheap thanks to the rookie pay scale!

watchkalibrun.com

by Zak Woods on Jun 27, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

I'm pretty much with you there.

And though I think they’re different people, we were burned by May, another overweight forward without a ton of athleticism.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jun 27, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Maybe it’s just me but I get the feeling that you’re politely implying that the Bobcats just drafted a 10th man.

Case of the beet bandit. Missing beets from all over the farm, no footprints. Inside job. Mose in socks. Boom. Case closed. -Dwight Schrute

by mjschaefer on Jun 27, 2009 5:57 PM EDT reply actions  

Haha...

But one with tons of energy.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jun 27, 2009 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

As I said before, with the 2nd round of the NBA draft you usually get 10th men if they even make the team.

The thing about Brown is there is potential (which is always what the NBA draft is about) that he could be a 10-15min player.

The fact that your 2nd round draft pick has the potential to fill that role is a positive.

watchkalibrun.com

by Zak Woods on Jun 28, 2009 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

Thanks Zak

I appreciate the insight on Brown and i too think his size and ability should translate into solid, high energy minutes off the bench for the Cats. The Bobcats are trying to build a franchise and players like Brown are what teams need off the bench: lots of energy, with the willingness to play defense and the ability to put points on the board while the starters are resting. Brown could be able to help in those regards immediately.

If i were you i wouldn’t pay any attention to Procto and the others who come here to complain about every move the Bobcats make. They know little to nothing about team basketball and rarely have any thing positive to contribute. Remember, Charlotte already ran off one NBA team and is working on another. And in a related note – if the Panthers don’t go to the Super Bowl every season then all the “fans” are ready to fire the head coach.

by dudemanhey on Jun 29, 2009 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Derrick Brown is a project, for sure, but

what makes him different is that he actually hasn’t hit a ceiling yet when he’s sought improvement. Every year at XU, he got better at what he needed to work on from the year before. If you saw him in ‘07, you wouldn’t believe how much bigger and better he is today.

I think he will prove everyone wrong and go beyond his projections by the time he’s 26 -27. Before then, he’ll see almost no time next year, 10 minutes the year after, and he’ll be the 6th or 7th man by his 3rd NBA season.

Anything you read about his lack of desire is totally laughable and it really blindsided me when I started reading that days before the draft. I really think that was spread to hurt his value because I saw little or no proof of that the last 2 years. As a matter of fact, he was always huge in the clutch, especially from deep. He DOES have killer instinct and grew into the player he is while XU sought that as a team. Trust me, this dude is a winner and has a quiet fire that will guide him into the NBA for a long time.

D Brown is not going to let himself, his family, or his alma mater down and Charlotte has got themselves a great pick.

by mdccclxix on Jun 29, 2009 8:25 PM EDT reply actions  

Thanks for the insight.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jun 29, 2009 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

well when I say lack of killer instinct I mean he was unable to take over a close game in the last five minutes. I know its a lot to ask of a player but it is usually a good indicator of how they will translate to the professional game.

When you compare Brown to other Xavier alums, David West/James Posey they all played with that instinct in college.

watchkalibrun.com

by Zak Woods on Jul 3, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions  

Brown is tearing it up in Summer league and the XU coach has tweeted

that Brown has a 2 year guaranteed deal!!! I’m officially a Bobcats fan!

by mdccclxix on Jul 10, 2009 3:27 AM EDT reply actions  

Hmm...

First, with this team’s current financial situation, I’ll wait and let them announce any guaranteed contract they didn’t need to offer. Secondly, “tearing it up” might be a bit much. Brown’s scoring, sure, but he’s taking lots of shots to do it. He’s leading the team in shots (by nine shots!) despite being fifth on the team in minutes. Scarily enough, he’s 9 shots behind Eric Maynor, a college gunner, despite playing more than 21 fewer minutes. And his 0-7 from 3PT range is a bit of a concern, as his his lack of rebounding (3.0 RPG) and assists (none so far.) I understand that summer league stats shouldn’t be read into too much, but if you’re going to say he’s tearing it up, I’m going to dispute it.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 10, 2009 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

You'll dispute anything...

…b/c your online persona is to be a prick! (i don’t know you’re real life persona)

It’s summer league, dude. And Brown is showing he has the tools to be an NBA player. I’m glad he’s gunning it, btw. He’s getting the most out of playing for some other team’s squad. I think the fact that he is 5th in minutes on ANOTHER nba team’s summer squad shows that he has skills. If he didn’t then he would barely get on the court at all.

by dudemanhey on Jul 10, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

If you say so...

But to me, scoring as a volume shooter (and doing nothing else) doesn’t tell me you’re NBA material, particularly when you’re doing it against NBA flameouts. That’s not going to be his role now or in the future. Further, if they weren’t going to give him minutes, we wouldn’t’ have sent him at all.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 10, 2009 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

If it comes from Mack, I'd say it's probably got some basis in reality. Here's a clip on Brown:

“Rookie forward Derrick Brown (Xavier) was a monster for Utah, displaying athleticism near the basket and making 10 of 15 shots on his way to 25 points in the Jazz’ 92-84 win over Orlando. Area of concern: Brown finished with 0 assists in 22 minutes.”

by mdccclxix on Jul 10, 2009 7:00 PM EDT reply actions  

I'm not saying he's lying...

But, again, why would the Bobcats (who have no money) have signed a 2nd-rounder to a multi-year, guaranteed contract without needing to? And yes, that was one of my concerns about Brown. He actually has no assists period in Summer League play (over 70 minutes.) For an SF, that’s worrisome, along with the fact that he’s putting up shots at such a high rate. However, without having seen the game, maybe the offense is just running through him whenever he’s on the floor and the Jazz are trying to get their own guys to focus on setting teammates up. I can see why that’d be a priority, particularly with Maynor, who will need to be more of a playmaker in the Association than he ever was in college.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 10, 2009 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

Honestly…what kind of time do you think a player…not on your “real team” will get

by andrewlail76 on Jul 12, 2009 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

What's your point?

The Bobcats wouldn’t have let him go without assurances he’d get decent PT.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 13, 2009 1:53 AM EDT up reply actions  

I just don't think tht is the case Procto...

…Look at Henderson riding the pine for the TWolves summer league team. I’m sure there were NO assurances past a promise to put him on the court at all. Same for Brown. With Bobcats not having a team at all this summer, they were in no position to negoiate the amount of pt their players were going to get. The Bobcats are lucky that there players are getting an opportunity to play period. The fact that Brown earned the respect of the Utah summer league players and coaches is great sign!

Brown got minutes in Orlando b/c he is a good player and was producing on the court. I ‘m not sure why you want to dislike Brown and talk shit already, but you seriously sound ridiculous. He averaged 13 points a game on 53% FG and 81% FT. You were talking shit about his 3point shooting, but over 5 games he was 1-8. Not good, but since we weren’t watching the games there’s no way of knowing the circumstances under which those shots were taken. How many were at the end of the shot clock, Procto? You don’t know.

Are you a Bobcats fan? or just a critic?

by dudemanhey on Jul 13, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Thanks...

I had posted this in another topic, but I’ll copy it to here…

Looks pretty much like what I predicted would happen, is going to happen.
No PT for Henderson on the Summer League.

Honestly, if you’re paying for a team, why would you want to showcase another team’s draft talent…especially if you wend draft heavy on guards…

OK
Summer League 2009 Budget Bobcats Lineup
G Henderson
D Brown
C Martin
VladRad
May
Diop
Nazr
Ajinca
Singletary
and then maybe throw in a few possibilities that didn’t get drafted…

Paul Harris…
somebody…
anybody…

by andrewlail76 on Jul 13, 2009 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

Summer league teams typically are just for 1st and 2nd year players and guys trying to catch on with a team. So Vlad, Diop and Nazr wouldn’t be playing. May probably wouldn’t either unless he thought he needed to show that he’s healthy like Shaun Livingston is doing for OKC.

A summer league team would have allowed the Bobcats to audition a couple guys they thought could plug a hole or two, such as backup PF. Would have been nice to preview an Augustine/Henderson backcourt, too.

by ClipCat on Jul 13, 2009 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Yes.

Although the only kinds of guys we could have brought in to test out at backup 4 would be players of the Andre Brown/Linton Johnson ilk.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 13, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agree

The pickings are slim, and the Bobcats probably wouldn’t have unearthed much more than training camp fodder (like last year). But there definitely would be an opportunity for an overlooked player to step up and make a case for himself.

by ClipCat on Jul 13, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

"Riding the pine?"

He got 18 minutes, as many as Corey Brewer, who started the game. Are you really going to quibble about another 4-6 minutes in ONE GAME? Brown got minutes for Utah because he was willing to jack it up as soon as he touched the ball and they wanted their guards (particularly Eric Maynor) to focus on distributing the ball. I haven’t for a second “talked shit” about Brown. I’ve questioned how he fits into this team and its needs. As a player who, best-case-scenario, will be deep in the rotation, he needs to focus on skills like rebounding and defense. As far as I can tell (and I did watch parts of every single game), he didn’t do much of either, and his 0:7 A:TO line leaves much to be desired as well. Also, I saw him hoist up at least 4-5 of those 3s with no shot clock pressure at all, and he wasn’t particularly open, either. Are you a rational observer of basketball? Or just an obstinate homer?

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 13, 2009 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

This is mere conjecture on your part:

“Brown got minutes for Utah because he was willing to jack it up as soon as he touched the ball and they wanted their guards (particularly Eric Maynor) to focus on distributing the ball.”

I’m sure you are well informed on the objectives of the Jazz coaching staff, huh? You said it —thought it sounded smart —and now are repeating it over and over.

You complain on here all the time that the Cats can’t score, then when one of their draft picks (that you don’t like already) does just that – on a pretty good FG % i might add – you complain that all he’s doing is “jacking up shots.” You say that that Brown is not focusing on rebounding or playmaking or defense. (if that’s not shit talking i’m not sure what it is.) You’re argument for Augustin and against Felton is that Felton can’t shoot, yet you gloss over the fact that Felton’s rebounding, playmaking and defense are superior to Augustin’s. You contort stats to rationalize your stupid opinions.

Procto, it is you that is the obstinate homer. Not for the Bobcats either, but for Duke and your own BS ideas on how to run an NBA team. I wouldn’t begin to classify you as “fan” of the Bobcats; More like a hater.

by dudemanhey on Jul 13, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

The consensus position on Maynor was that he'd need to work on being a distributor rather than a shooter
He takes quite a few shots for someone who shows such excellent potential as a playmaker

—Draftexpress

Settles for too many jumpers

—nbadraft.net

And finally:
At the college level you were a big time scorer from the point guard position. In the NBA, do you see yourself continuing to be a scorer or will you develop as more of a pass first guard?

I think I’m going to establish myself as a pass first guy. You’ve got guys that are all-stars who are putting up 28, 29 points per game. That’s what those guys are paid to do, score. These teams want someone who can get those guys the ball and run a team. They want someone who can get those guys their shots and find them in their sweet spot.

—Eric Maynor himself

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 13, 2009 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's an organizational philosophy, man...

Jerry Sloan despises rushed shots and poor shot selection.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 14, 2009 8:44 AM EDT up reply actions  

There's no comparison between the needs of a rookie deep bench SF and a starting fifth-year veteran PG.

The PG (Felton) needs to exhibit good shot selection, limit careless turnovers, and make his teammates better. Felton does none of the above, and he’s certainly no more capable than Augustin as a leader of the offense.

The SF needs to be able to provide hustle and energy, namely in the form of rebounding and defense. If he scores, it’ll need to be within the flow of the offense as the 4th or 5th option on the floor, not as the #1.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 14, 2009 8:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

What do you want? Expect?

Brown averaged 13.2 points and 3 rebounds pg on 53% FG and 81% FT. He’s a second round pick playing on another team’s squad.

You complain about his D, but you don’t care about D, remember? You wan’t the Cats to score more? Well here you go Procto: a reserve forward that can put points on the board! So quit your bitching! You never have anything positive to say.

by dudemanhey on Jul 13, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

For an SF...

I’d like something like twice as many rebounds as he got, some defense (which I do care about, don’t know where you heard I didn’t), and a MUCH better A:TO ratio than 0:7. Being able to “put points on the board” as a volume shooter against the kind of competition he was playing doesn’t really say much at all, much less that he’ll be able to do it in the regular season.

Remember, kids...don't ever let facts get in the way of your argument.

by MichaelProcton on Jul 14, 2009 8:43 AM EDT up reply actions  

After his 25 point debut in Orlando, I am starting to think this kid is the real deal.

Justin

by jmiller112 on Jul 12, 2009 12:55 AM EDT reply actions  

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