Larry Brown on PG and PF Situations
Bobcats coach Larry Brown made it clear pre-game Saturday that he isn't going to regularly play three point guards just to keep everyone happy. That essentially means it's an either/or proposition between D.J. Augustin and Flip Murray as Raymond Felton's backup.
Once again, it's kind of mind-boggling that LB believes playing Flip at PG and (possibly) getting more present-day production outweighs the advantages of giving D.J. real NBA minutes and better preparing him for taking over the position next season.
9 months ago
David A. Arnott
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DJ vs. Flip
If Larry is only going to play two point guards, the back-up will be an easy choice. Flip Murray was a non-factor against Philly. When he played the Bobcats lost leads and let Philly go on runs. We don’t need a point guard with a shoot first, pass if he gets a chance mentality. If DJ is in a slump give Acie Law a chance.
I don't think it's that mind boggling
Playing a proven veteran over a 2nd year player that has struggled all year. LB wants to win now. He’s not down for building a team for 2-3 years from now, because he probably won’t be here then.
DJ got plenty of time early on, and consistently didn’t perform. He’s an undersized jump shooter who isn’t hitting his shots.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Not his fault though south
DJ is missing his shots because mean ol’ Larry Brown didn’t just hand over the starting spot to him this year. That’s why he can’t play D, isn’t a great passer, and is shooting worse than Raymond Felton. 20 minutes per gave hasn’t given enough time to get into a rhythm yet! And he’s playing against the other team’s second unit (where all the best players play). So it’s Brown’s fault that he sucks this year. Didn’t you know that here at ROF DJ stands for “Damn-near Jesus?”
Can’t blame DJ for anything
I don't get it
Felton has always shown more grit and determination than anyone on this team. Larry Brown comes in and he tries to soak up everything he can from the guy… and his improvement is obvious. Lately he’s played just as well as guys like Chauncey Billups. Yet the fans hate him.
Augustine on the other hand is named by many as “the future” as soon as he’s drafted. Yet he’s never done anything other than hit an occasional wide open 3.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Felton does nothing any average NBA PG can't do.
He can’t shoot past 12 feet, he can’t run an offense, and he’s a total disaster in crunch time. Or maybe you haven’t been watching him not improve at all over the last four years.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 7:50 PM EST up reply actions
Maybe YOU haven't watched him improve since Brown came onboard
6 for 6 3p over the past 4 games, I do believe that’s beyond 12 feet
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Four games do define a player's skillset. Good call.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
Well at least you admit to having ignored them
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I've seen it too...
4 games…good job Felton…I’ll admit he’s improved in 15 – 20 more games.
Saying that Felton is the man now…that’s like saying that Boris is the man now…after 1 good game…
by andrewlail76 on Dec 6, 2009 11:49 PM EST up reply actions
Good for you.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 7, 2009 12:19 AM EST up reply actions
I agree, that's why no one said he's the man
Acknowledged his determination and progression under LB… For some reason people don’t like that.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I should define the term "the man"
In saying “the man”, I am referring to a term that I would use to describe who is the person BEST suited to start in that position.
Mr. Felton has had a string of solid games. By definition, I suppose you could say he’s the best, of the best, of the rest, of what is left at PG. 4 games a season does not make. Returning to the term “the man” , I am using a bit of sarcasm in saying that Mr. Diaw is “the man”. It was meant to be funny since we have no other options at that position. In regards to all of the above mentioned, I am saying that 4 good games doesn’t mean that Felton is instantly our starting choice when we have other PGs that could fill the position. Without playing time, you can’t play through a slump, or if the slump is over, 5 minutes does not prove to the fans that the slump is over. Diaw had 1 strong game. He’s still not a true PF, but in terms of being funny, he’s “the man” for PF…cause he is the best, of the best of the rest, of what is left…and by “the man” I’m still referring to the best (or only) option at the position…
I do know…
“the man” deserves $10mil per season…and that man is not Felton or Diaw…
by andrewlail76 on Dec 8, 2009 12:52 PM EST up reply actions
The last 4 games have nothing to do with Felton starting
DJ last year looked like he had potential to put up a lot of points. However he wasn’t as good of a defender as Felton, and averaged less assists (per equal minutes). So it made since to use Felton as the game manager, and DJ as just a shooter.
Well this year, Feltons FG% and 3P% went up, but DJs went down! Combine that with the fact that while Raymonds CAN BE STREAKY… he also is willing and has made many clutch shots under pressure.
He’s got the attitude to be “the man”. DJ on the other hand looks like he’s cracking under pressure.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
28% last year in endgame situations.
Yeah, that’s a guy who makes lots of clutch shots.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 8, 2009 4:56 PM EST up reply actions
LOL! So you agree on the other points then.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I got attitude to be "the man"
And I can understand what I would be coached to do…
but I can’t physically execute.
Felton’s been in the league for a while..DJ hasn’t…
I’m going to just watch the game
Not point in arguing. Bottom line is Felton is not a $10mil a year PG…I see Felton coming out and DJ coming in…I think I’ll watch for a while…
You're totally right.
Having to carry the offensive load alongside offensive studs like Derrick Brown and Felton and Stephen Graham must be easier than Felton’s job of having to look good alongside Wallace, Jackson, and Diaw. Augustin’s clearly in a positoin to succeed.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 7:49 PM EST up reply actions
You really like to twist things
Are you sure that when DJ was in the game, he was always playing with Brown and Graham? Because other than the 1st 8 minutes, I have noticed LB rotate players, and always keep some veterans in.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I'm talking about who he plays the majority of his minutes with.
And the majority of his minutes come with backups. Felton rarely, if ever, has to play with the backups.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 8:27 PM EST up reply actions
So DJ's team makes him suck?
I don’t think he would use that excuse so why do you?
So Brown and Graham are why he can't hit his wide open shots or free throws?
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Augustin's hit 87% of his 270 career FTs and 42% of his 279 career three-pointers.
I fail to see a problem, unless you think a stretch that’s included a respective 14 and 12% of those totals is enough to define a trend, rather than an aberration. I, however, don’t. Just like a four-game stretch that includes some blessed relent of Felton’s 2-14, 4 TO nights or one where the Bobbies win all of their games or even one where Chandler looks like a competent NBA player don’t define what those concepts are. Regression to the mean works both ways.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 10:29 PM EST up reply actions
You finally taking that statistics class I’ve been telling you to take Procton?
Well, at least it’s a step in the right direction.
DJ’s shooting under .300 from the 3pt line this season. That is a bad sign considering that teams are defending him differently now. If he doesn’t adjust he’s in trouble. That can happen, and I hope it does. But let’s stop making excuses for DJ. DJ is still working w/ a small sample size chief. Small enough that we can’t draw too many conclusions right now.
Get it right and1roid
DJs allowed to have up and down seasons, but Raymonds NOT allowed to have up and down games.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Little bit of hyperbole there
‘up and down seasons’ referring to DJ I guess means up for a season, then down for a 1/5th of a season.
The frustration fans have with Felton is the ‘up and down games’ is that they are still occuring his 5th year in the league when he should be consistent.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Dec 7, 2009 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
Who on this team hasn't?
I have seen Wallace completely disappear in games. I remember him this year not being able to hit a single jump shot, then a couple games later start nailing 3s.
Like Felton though, at this stage, he’s not a Superstar that can win games consistently without talent around him. Since LB showed up they’ve both improved.
Mack Calvin, Ray Williams, Charlie Scott… LB is know for shaping these guys. And Felton’s ears are wide open.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Really?
How exactly did Brown “shape” Charlie Scott? He coached him for exactly one season (his next to last), in which he established career lows in scoring, steals, and rebounds.
Ray Williams? Another guy with just one season under Brown. And in his fifth NBA season at age 27, in the peak of his career, he established two career-high marks: steals and turnovers.
And finally, Mack Calvin. Calvin played for Brown for five seasons on two different teams, and he was never as good a player as he was in his early years before Brown had ever coached him. So if by “shaping these guys,” you mean that he coached them to below-peak performance, sure, he did that.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 7, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions
What are you like 90 years old?
Point being that Brown always focuses and demands the most out of his point guards. Feltons never had that in his pro career. LB says he’s soaking it up, and he’s been improving ever since LB showed up.
For some reason you don’t want to believe LB can make him better than he was before LB showed up. I don’t get that.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Hmmmm...
Is soaking it up the same as being able to translate it into consistent good play?
Can Brown teach him to be better? Yes…
Can Felton physically perform what is being taught?
Well…we’re at year 2 with LB and Felton has strung together 1 consistent stretch so far…we will se what happens through the season…
by andrewlail76 on Dec 8, 2009 12:42 PM EST up reply actions
If at the end of this year he's no better then I'll be on board with you
But even then, until we get someone better, he’s the guy… because DJ has done nothing to show that he can lead this team.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
It all boils down to
the oldest of NBA axioms – you go with the hot hand.
Felton is playing some of the best ball of his career at present. He gets the minutes.
Augustin is playing… well, we can’t really call it PLAYING can we? So he loses the minutes.
If Felton keeps it up he’ll keep his minutes and get his contract bucks at the end of the year whether it’s with Charlotte or some other team.
We can argue about it until we’re blue in the face but the only resolution that will decide who is correct will be found with the passage of time.
Can we just table this until say, Jan 15th or so? Then we can hand out the “I told you so”s and the cigars and cupie dolls to whichever side was right about Raymond Felton.
by Ourdaywillcome on Dec 8, 2009 5:36 PM EST up reply actions
That sort of ignores the fact that Felton isn't going to have many 48-minute nights.
Somebody has to be the backup (particularly on nights when Felton does not) have it going, and there is no way that person should be Flip Murray.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 8, 2009 6:18 PM EST up reply actions
Neither one of them are getting it done
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
So why not play the one who's not at or past his prime in the hopes he can improve from 20 games worth of poor play?
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 8, 2009 9:56 PM EST up reply actions
He hasn't been "improving ever since Brown showed up."
His numbers last year were exactly the same as they were in each of his first three. Now you may believe that a four-game stretch means he’s magically transformed into a different player, and maybe he has, but I frankly think that seems like a stretch.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 8, 2009 3:03 PM EST up reply actions
So tell me why DJ should start then???
The guy who never was as good a defender as Felton… who never averaged as many assists (per equal minutes) as Felton… and who unlike Felton, though SOMETIMES STREAKY, in multiple games has been able to hit clutch shots under pressure… DJ instead get’s in a little funk as a backup this year, can’t take the criticism from LB, and totally crumbles… WHY should that guy ever lead this team???
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
What evidence do you have?
That DJ “can’t take criticism and totally crumbles.” It’s true he’s struggled this year, but one can just as easily say that Brown’s sorry coaching and roster management is a major factor. While I’m disappointed by DJ’s play, I’m just as disappointed by Brown’s inability to develop a lottery pick PG.
Whatever the cause of DJ’s struggles, I’m still optimistic that he can turn things around this season. With Felton possibly lost to free agency next season, the Bobcats need to find out what they have with DJ this year. As long as he’s healthy, he needs to be playing 15-20 minutes per night with a chance to earn additional PT based on his on court performance.
I think DJ will turn it around too
But be the leader of the team?… This is a huge Red flag. Especially for a guy whose never been great as a PG in the first place.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
Juwan Howard was a great leader.
Strangely enough, we didn’t even resign him.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 8, 2009 9:56 PM EST up reply actions
He was a terrible basketball player.
Blogging at Ridiculous Upside, where my terrible writing meets people's eyes.
Augustin's played well just as often as Murray.
And, again, don’t you dare accuse Brown of not caring about this team’s future. That totally makes you a “fake fan,” because Brown loves MJ and is in it for the long haul.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 7:38 PM EST up reply actions
The whole proclaiming people as certain types of fans really sounds childish
You do not own a monopoly on fans loyalty or opinions.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
I was being sarcastic, chief.
I clearly don’t care about how anybody’s “fandom” is defined.
Remember when the Panthers had a good offensive line? Yeah, me too.
--Darin Gantt
by MichaelProcton on Dec 6, 2009 10:23 PM EST up reply actions
I think southtunnel hasn't been here for the whole 'Procton isn't a fan' thing
You’ll have to give him a break on that one.
Cat Scratch Reader's resident optimist.
by James The Aussie on Dec 6, 2009 10:42 PM EST up reply actions
My bad... thought you were completely perturbed about it.
on behalf of tha dirty south: soul food, carolina blue, southern hospitality, and tha queen city
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